splitting the dwarves

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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby heliona » Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:27 am

Wildwood wrote:I can't even begin to figure out how that even popped into their heads, much less continued to develop into what we eventually saw.


In the extended version of AUJ, Kili flirts with one of the elves in Rivendell, so I presume it was on their minds from early on. (It was a rather cringe-worthy scene. Funny if you take it as intended, but ridiculous if you remember the history of Tolkien's dwarves and elves.)
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby Gorthaur the Cruel » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:12 pm

heliona wrote:
Wildwood wrote:I can't even begin to figure out how that even popped into their heads, much less continued to develop into what we eventually saw.


In the extended version of AUJ, Kili flirts with one of the elves in Rivendell, so I presume it was on their minds from early on.

It was in there from Guillermo del Toro days, firstly in order to get a strong female character in (I'm sorry they don't seem to have made Bombur female) and secondly to try to start to break down the culture of segregation in Middle-earth at that time.
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby siddharth » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:27 pm

Honestly, if you take out that one healing scene in Laketown (a scene which imo is the second worst among all the 5 films) Tauriel-Kili resemble the relationship between Legolas and Gimli more than anything.
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby jotnar » Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:30 pm

siddharth wrote:Honestly, if you take out that one healing scene in Laketown (a scene which imo is the second worst among all the 5 films) Tauriel-Kili resemble the relationship between Legolas and Gimli more than anything.

Yes, I remember well that scene where Gimli laments Legolas not having made close acquaintance with the contents of his (Gimli's) trousers. :twisted:
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby Wildwood » Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:36 pm

:shock: :oops: :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Hmm. I hadn't thought of that! Will have to consider that one for a bit! More a copy of the Legolas/Gimli friendship bond than the Gimli/Galadriel admire-from-afar thing. The flirtiness, though - what do you make of that? And they were definitely showing Legolas as threatened or jealous over it! Your thoughts? :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby heliona » Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:46 pm

Wildwood wrote:And they were definitely showing Legolas as threatened or jealous over it! Your thoughts? :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D


That was just plain stupid, if it was meant to jealousy. The likelihood of Tauriel going off with a dwarf is so small that there wouldn't be any need for Legolas to be jealous.
Image<-- Celebrating Science in the TVM!

Life is short; break the rules, forgive quickly; kiss slowly; love truly; laugh uncontrollably; and never regret anything that made you smile. Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Grab a chance and you won't be sorry for the might-have-beens. - Arthur Ransome

Just because I have the vocabulary of a well-educated sailor doesn't mean I'm not a lady.

In Memoriam EDW - March 14th 2009
In Memoriam rowanberry - March 1st 2014 (~In Memoriam AHH - Alfred Lord Tennyson~)

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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby Wildwood » Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:53 pm

I can't say for sure that was what I was meant to pick up from that. It's just how it hit me! :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D Indeed, the two main things I came away feeling about Legolas and Tauriel are that, first, he is into her but he seems reluctant to act, almost as if she is not high enough to satisfy his father? And second, that he is jealous of the connection she seems to have forged with Kili. Did anyone else pick up on these things? I may be reading a lot more in than was actually there! :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby jotnar » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:04 pm

Wildwood wrote:I can't say for sure that was what I was meant to pick up from that. It's just how it hit me! :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D Indeed, the two main things I came away feeling about Legolas and Tauriel are that, first, he is into her but he seems reluctant to act, almost as if she is not high enough to satisfy his father? And second, that he is jealous of the connection she seems to have forged with Kili. Did anyone else pick up on these things? I may be reading a lot more in than was actually there! :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Unfortunately, I think that was exactly what was on screen. The cringes were most certainly worthy... ;)
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby heliona » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:08 pm

I just tried not to read that into it (although I suspect that's exactly how it was meant to be) because I hate that idea. I do think that they are good friends (Legolas and Tauriel) as is evidenced by Legolas going after Tauriel. But him being jealous/threatened by a dwarf I just tried to ignore. :D I can understand him not necessarily wanting to make a move on her for fear of his father (since his father is obviously disapproving of the idea) - elves after all do have feelings. :D

Over the years, I've developed a talent of being able to ignore the bits I don't like in the Middle-earth films. :D
Image<-- Celebrating Science in the TVM!

Life is short; break the rules, forgive quickly; kiss slowly; love truly; laugh uncontrollably; and never regret anything that made you smile. Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Grab a chance and you won't be sorry for the might-have-beens. - Arthur Ransome

Just because I have the vocabulary of a well-educated sailor doesn't mean I'm not a lady.

In Memoriam EDW - March 14th 2009
In Memoriam rowanberry - March 1st 2014 (~In Memoriam AHH - Alfred Lord Tennyson~)

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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby siddharth » Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:14 am

Jotnar - :P Amended post. Take out the healing and those few lines.

Wildwood wrote::shock: :oops: :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Hmm. I hadn't thought of that! Will have to consider that one for a bit! More a copy of the Legolas/Gimli friendship bond than the Gimli/Galadriel admire-from-afar thing. The flirtiness, though - what do you make of that? And they were definitely showing Legolas as threatened or jealous over it! Your thoughts? :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D


It really felt like the Legolas-Gimli bond - of two (appropriately young) individuals showing curiosity towards each others' races as they have been astranged to the others' culture for so long.
Of course, there are hints of some romance as well and I can't say what happens in TABA. But I like it so far. (REPEAT: If you exclude the healing and a few lines.)

Not a fan of the Legolas-jealousy thingummy but I can sense that they are trying to give him a proper character. The Legolas in LotR was bland and perhaps the least interesting character (both film and book. Sorry! :P ). I can't say I like it but I don't think it was stupid. As there is a reason behind it that I can guess unlike some other changes. :D
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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby heliona » Sat Jan 18, 2014 5:50 am

siddharth wrote:The Legolas in LotR was bland and perhaps the least interesting character (both film and book. Sorry! :P ).


You know, I really wasn't impressed with Legolas when I first read LotR, mainly because I wasn't fond of the Mirkwood elves overall, due to my reading of The Hobbit. But after the film, I reread LotR again, much more carefully (I read quite fast, so I end up missing things - it took me twenty years to notice that Dwalin had a blue beard! :shock: ) and if you concentrate on Legolas, he's actually an interesting character. Tolkien doesn't really write that much about him (just as he doesn't about Gimli, really) but what hints are dropped are really interesting.
Image<-- Celebrating Science in the TVM!

Life is short; break the rules, forgive quickly; kiss slowly; love truly; laugh uncontrollably; and never regret anything that made you smile. Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Grab a chance and you won't be sorry for the might-have-beens. - Arthur Ransome

Just because I have the vocabulary of a well-educated sailor doesn't mean I'm not a lady.

In Memoriam EDW - March 14th 2009
In Memoriam rowanberry - March 1st 2014 (~In Memoriam AHH - Alfred Lord Tennyson~)

Photos: My Flickr Photo Collections & Wee Nell - the furry ball of mischief!


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Re: splitting the dwarves

Postby solicitr » Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:44 pm

Kili must be one kinky Dwarf, to be attracted to hideous smooth-faced females. How many humans males are into bald women?
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