Game of Thrones

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby rwhen » Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:52 pm

Thank you for the correction, changed. I am reading in book 2 at the moment, but I know that from others, Robb's wife wasn't at the wedding...other than that, I don't know the relationship beyond this point. But in the show, you are absolutely right...the naming the baby after Eddard Stark was brilliant....pffffft, especially in light of how it all turns out.

On one website they call folks who have read the books "sullied" and those who haven't the "unsullied". For some reason I love that.

On the sacking of the city, I just wished to see more of it. I watched the previews three times and it is pretty hard to tell anything. But I am anxious to see a few plots resolved...maybe wedding?

One thing you have to give to GRRM. He sure doesn't mind killing off his leading characters.
Last edited by rwhen on Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby hamlet » Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:54 pm

Well, let's face it, as complicated as the show is, the situation in the books is dramatically more so and would be imossible to portray faithfully. I think they absolutely had to cut a few corners and shorten a few threads there just for the sake of sanity.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hobbituk » Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:04 pm

Yep, I agree and (unlike GRRMartin) their budget is finite.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby krawler » Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:41 pm

Ah, so they finally got to the Red Wedding. I've been looking forward to the inevitable backlash from that scene.

*sits back and watches the internet* Image
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby hamlet » Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:57 pm

Hobbituk wrote:Yep, I agree and (unlike GRRMartin) their budget is finite.


Well, that's not quite right. I'm sure GRRM's budget is quite finite.

It's just that his special effects are really cheap and his overhead in terms of sets, actors, and etc., are fantastially low. :P
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby rwhen » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:16 pm

krawler wrote:Ah, so they finally got to the Red Wedding. I've been looking forward to the inevitable backlash from that scene.

*sits back and watches the internet* Image



I have heard there has been a bunch of garbage spewed about the webz....but mostly I think people were just stunned more than anything else.

In the big picture I think it was really REALLY well done. The viewer was built up to a lovely place and then smacked with the salmon of correction.

That is a good thing.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Pericles » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:27 am

Hobbituk wrote:(I think you said Stannis when you meant Tywin, there, rwhen :) So many names though!)

Yes, it was the death of Robb's wife that jarred for me. I had no problem with her being at the Wedding, it was a good way of giving closure to their relationship and the scene where they discussed the name of the child was gorgeous. However, I was expecting her to escape with the Blackfish. Not wanting to give anything away about future books, her non-survival makes me wonder about how they will handle future events involving those two characters.



Yes, I was also fully expecting her to be saved by the Blackfish, also based on the conjecture about book-version of Robb's wife. I think the television version of the Red Wedding well and truly stabs any theories about his book-version wife in the belly. The added death was gruesome but I think in-keeping with what GRRM wrote. I'm just relieved that the 'Talisa as Lannister spy' theories which have bounded about on the internet were not correct.

It was a stunning scene, beautifully staged, wonderfully acted, emotionally-wrenching.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Frelga » Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:48 pm

Red Wedding was the part where I began to get tired of the books. During the first one, I was completely taken in by Martin playing out a trope and then veering off, defeating expectations. Later, the play-and-veer became predictable in itself, and the wedding (and Arya's near-miss) was signaled a hundred pages ahead. It got so bad that at the final reveal at the end of the book, horrifying as it was meant to be, I just had to laugh aloud. Mind, that was about the only time I laughed reading the books.

Movies look good, though.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Pericles » Thu Jun 06, 2013 3:01 am

Frelga wrote:Red Wedding was the part where I began to get tired of the books. During the first one, I was completely taken in by Martin playing out a trope and then veering off, defeating expectations. Later, the play-and-veer became predictable in itself, and the wedding (and Arya's near-miss) was signaled a hundred pages ahead. It got so bad that at the final reveal at the end of the book, horrifying as it was meant to be, I just had to laugh aloud. Mind, that was about the only time I laughed reading the books.

Movies look good, though.


I didn't see it coming at all. It shocked me and actually prevented me from sleeping for some time that night - I cannot remember when else a book has done that to me (and I did literature for a degree so have read a fair bit). I think Martin does subvert expectations but I don't think that is all he is doing - the Red Wedding is a believable consequence of bad decisions. Too often in literature and film the natural consequences of decisions and actions are not played out because the creator wants to protect their 'hero'. unfortunately, I think Martin himself has been guilty of that in Books 4 and 5. The series actually needs another Red Wedding type event - to remove the invincibility of some key players, and inject a bit of interest again.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Frelga » Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:35 pm

I am not saying that Martin only ever subverts the tropes. In fact, as far as I've got in the books, he's been playing Sam's "finding courage" trope pretty straight, and I hope he keeps it that way. He does other things extremely well. I love how he is true to portraying the consequences of a world where communication is slow and unreliable, for example, and I like what he did with the female characters, who are strong, active, and sensual, but have to deal with the constraints of a male-dominated society.

But I did get a sense of how he's handling his plot twists, and while I can rarely predict what he would do, I became pretty good at guessing what he would NOT do as expected.

And the wedding just made me think of Cohen the Barbarian in Interesting Times. ;) "something simple with pasta"
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hobbituk » Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:46 pm

One good rule when trying to guess what GRRM will or will not do:

If a character says,

"I AM GOING TO DO X"

... the only thing certain is that that character will NEVER do X.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby rwhen » Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:09 am

Season 3 is all over but the cryin'.

Over all, it was a wonderful season. Many surprises for the unsullied and twists for the sullied as well.

So far I rate them. Season 1, then 3 then 2.

I am almost through with book 3. When season 4 comes out I will be ahead of the episodes for the first time.

GoT has been nominated this year for Emmy's, Critics Choice awards and has broken most all records for HBO programming. I think it will be around for a long time.
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And getting into trouble with Rally The Eldar.

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby heliona » Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:36 am

SPOILERS! FOR SEASON 3 EPISODE 9 & 10.



SPOILERS!




SPOILERS!





YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!






So, I've finally seen all of Season 3. I'm a non-book reader, as I read the first book, and got fed up of following characters I didn't like, and of the three I did, one was killed, and the other two barely mentioned! I had visions of the Wheel of Time, with more and more characters introduced and me caring less and less about most of them. So I finished the first book and haven't read the rest. I do think that I'll probably go back to them soon, since I can now put faces to names - it's difficult to keep track of everyone! :D

(From the television series, I'm guessing now that I'm wrong, assuming that most of the characterisations on screen are similar to how they are in the book. It seems that GRRM and Robert Jordan are different writers: GRRM makes characters that initially seem completely unlike-able end up with redeeming qualities, whereas Robert Jordan goes the opposite way. All of his characters that start off all right end up being horrid people that the reader doesn't care whether they live or die. At least in my opinion!)

Now, as a person who hasn't read the books: Theon is a pain in the behind, and the torture scenes are simply that: torture. I really dislike them (not because of the torture, but because I never liked Theon as a character and thus I can't care what happens to him).

I agree that "You know nothing, Jon Snow" is getting tedious!

The Red Wedding didn't come as a surprise to me. You could say that I was tipped off to something happening in that episode thanks to the internet exploding after it aired, but because of that I was expecting a "Luke, I am your father" or "The Ring with go to Gondor" moment. Not what did happen. As soon as Robb's wife announced she was pregnant, I expected that the baby at least was not long for this world! Since GRRM is known for killing off characters, and none had been killed in a long time, it was kind of expected.

As soon as Catelyn saw the door shutting, I knew what was going to happen. It reminded me of the Massacre of Glencoe, actually. The acting was brilliant, though. Hats off to everyone there for that.

As much as I want to punch Joffrey in the face repeatedly, I do love the scenes between him and Tywin. That line about monsters and kings from Tyrion was fabulous too.

However, by far the most important question I was left with was: what's happened to Ghost?! Image
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hobbituk » Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:07 am

Ghost is, and this isn't a book spoiler, still roaming around north of the wall. He couldn't climb it with Jon and the Wildlings.

Oh and I'm almost certain the Red Wedding was heavily inspired by the Massacre of Glencoe, I thought the same when I read it (or when I read it for the second time anyway... I wouldn't have known about the Massacre of Glencoe the first time I read it).

Agreed on Theon and the torture scenes. I said it at the beginning of the season and they didn't convince me otherwise. Horrible to watch and unnecessary. I do like the lad playing Ramsay though. He's nicely diabolical.

I do like reading the opinions and predictions of the non-book people, slightly envious in a way!
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby heliona » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:26 am

Hobbituk wrote:Ghost is, and this isn't a book spoiler, still roaming around north of the wall. He couldn't climb it with Jon and the Wildlings.


The last I remember seeing him he was with Sam just before those idiots decided to kill everyone and he did a runner with Gilly. Ghost did seemed to have abandoned Jon for a while. :D He's probably safer north of the wall, anyway. :D

Oh and I'm almost certain the Red Wedding was heavily inspired by the Massacre of Glencoe, I thought the same when I read it (or when I read it for the second time anyway... I wouldn't have known about the Massacre of Glencoe the first time I read it).


Since GRRM has taken inspiration from English history, I didn't think it was much of a leap to think that the Red Wedding may be been inspired by Scots history. Perhaps that's why I wasn't surprised by it?

I do like the lad playing Ramsay though. He's nicely diabolical.


Agreed. I kept being distracted by thinking I've seen him before in something, though! (I've had a Google of him, and I haven't seen anything he's been in - he must just look like someone else! :D )

I do like reading the opinions and predictions of the non-book people, slightly envious in a way!


My prediction: anyone that I remotely like (and probably a lot of people that I don't) is going to die a horrible death. :D Oh, and nothing good is going to happen to anyone. Ever! ;)
Image<-- Cute Border Collie puppy for Cute animal month in the TVM!

Life is short; break the rules, forgive quickly; kiss slowly; love truly; laugh uncontrollably; and never regret anything that made you smile. Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did. So throw off the bowlines, sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.

Grab a chance and you won't be sorry for the might-have-beens. - Arthur Ransome

Just because I have the vocabulary of a well-educated sailor doesn't mean I'm not a lady.

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Dunthule » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:11 pm

Winter is coming! :twisted:

Having read the books, next season should start off with a bang.

I've read all of the books and could barely finish the last one. It's become a bit Jordanesque IMHO.
The HBO series may actually become better than the books as the plot lines and list of characters need to stay 'confined' for a lack of a better term.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby portia » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:31 am

I lurk on this thread, for reasons I do not understand. However, I will de lurk to comment that differing budgets, for character salaries, CG, locations, etc. are another major reason why your favorite book may be different from the movie.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby hamlet » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:48 pm

Dunthule wrote:Winter is coming! :twisted:


Not freakin' quick enough let me tell you!

I've read all of the books and could barely finish the last one. It's become a bit Jordanesque IMHO.
The HBO series may actually become better than the books as the plot lines and list of characters need to stay 'confined' for a lack of a better term.


Heathen! Blasphemer!

Summon the mob with the torches and pitchforks! :twisted:
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby MeadowForest » Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:39 am

I do like the lad playing Ramsay though. He's nicely diabolical.


Yes! He is a suitable kind of hinting on sinister.

Agreed. I kept being distracted by thinking I've seen him before in something, though! (I've had a Google of him, and I haven't seen anything he's been in - he must just look like someone else! :D )


I was surprised when I was told that the cruel Ramsay is the same guy who plays the sweet next door guy in the ITV comedy 'Vicious'. What a change!
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby siddharth » Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:23 am

portia wrote:I lurk on this thread, for reasons I do not understand. However, I will de lurk to comment that differing budgets, for character salaries, CG, locations, etc. are another major reason why your favorite book may be different from the movie.

Looks like I'm not the only one here. Of course, with reasons I do not understand as well. ;)

*Hurries back to lurking mode*
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby niniel* » Mon Aug 12, 2013 5:49 am

MeadowForest wrote:
I do like the lad playing Ramsay though. He's nicely diabolical.


Yes! He is a suitable kind of hinting on sinister.

Agreed. I kept being distracted by thinking I've seen him before in something, though! (I've had a Google of him, and I haven't seen anything he's been in - he must just look like someone else! :D )


I was surprised when I was told that the cruel Ramsay is the same guy who plays the sweet next door guy in the ITV comedy 'Vicious'. What a change!


And simon (superhero) from Misfits where he is excellent.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby rwhen » Wed Sep 25, 2013 1:34 pm

*thrums fingers on the desk* Is it March yet? *sigh*


I made myself stop reading in book 4. I think I prefer to be surprised, like I was at the Red Wedding. Now I know what happens at the Purple Wedding and it would have been much more delicious had I waited. Rats. No GRRM reading for a few years I suppose. I wish they could do two a year. Spring and fall. A year is too long to wait for something that is only ten hours long. Hummmppppfffffff.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby portia » Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:41 am

De-lurking to comment that there are many stories in, especially Scots history, of someone setting up a banquet with a rival, getting them to leave major arms outside, then locking them in and slaughtering the whole bunch, or setting fire to them. You'd think that the Scots would have been more suspicious.

The same probably goes for the residents of the seven kingdoms.
Back to lurking.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby rwhen » Mon Sep 30, 2013 9:03 am

portia, I don't think so much that it was a surprise as it was just shocking. If one is "unsullied" as I was at the time, you get that something is going to happen when Catelyn watches them lock the doors and she see's the armor under Roose's clothing. The scene happens very fast from the time that Talisa gets killed to Catelyn and all that happens in the middle. Very very good acting in those scenes, it has one riveted to the screen, I think even if one is sullied.

I was watching the show lying down and sat bolt upright just staring. There are YouTube video's out there that have people screaming during this part. Or cursing the TV. Or just shaking their heads, which is what I was doing.

I can't wait until March. Also, before then they will show the last season over again. For those who have HBO DIRECT, you can still watch any of the seasons, all episodes for free. It might have been a good thing to do during this horrid weather we have had this past weekend....certainly wasn't good for going out of doors.

****Winter is Coming....
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The Expected Party!! is now on the road to Gondor to celebrate. Join us.

And getting into trouble with Rally The Eldar.

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Gohan » Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:36 am

with such a huge budget and success
I am looking forward to the next movies :)
Something different than LOTR
You can see how society transcends but the LOTR will always remain special
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hobbituk » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:18 am

Anyone watching this season? ;)

The big twist at the end of the last episode was deftly handled, I felt. A very odd and unsettling episode culminating in one of the biggest 'pull the rug out from under you' moments so far. The Purple Wedding isn't *quite* the Red Wedding, but nearly.

Also, replacing Ser Ilyn Payne with Bronn in the narrative is one of the shrewdest pieces of adaption they've done so far, even though it was driven by necessity.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Arlaug » Thu Apr 17, 2014 1:38 pm

I am :D
As I am no longer a reader, I enjoy the plot so far.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby solicitr » Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:28 am

Basic rule with GRRM: if you don't actually see a character die onscreen*, he/she is almost certainly not dead.

*and sometimes not even then. :twisted:
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby hamlet » Mon Apr 21, 2014 7:45 am

Watched the first two episodes of season 2 on Easter. Can't say that I actually liked them very much.

They weren't bad, just not to my taste anymore. The show has grown away from me.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hobbituk » Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:11 am

I thought you'd already seen season 2, Hamlet?

We certainly discussed it anyway :)
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