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Postby Gandalf'sMother » Sat Jun 16, 2001 11:27 am

<i>You're a very atypical movie-goer, Saranthir.</i><BR><BR>Yes. And rightfully so. Due to the insane amount of money "Mummy Returns" was able to generate, it seems the 'typical' movie-goer is not entirely credible.<BR><BR>-Mother maiar
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Postby dudalb » Sat Jun 16, 2001 12:29 pm

Oh My! A lot of People go to see a movie that Gandalfs Mother does not approve of! What an outrage!<BR>Of course it would be a better world if GM controlled the film industry and decided that only films he liked and were "Good" for people be produced.<BR>GM, anybody tell you that at time you give the impression that anybody who does not like the things you like is either stupid or evil? I enjoyed the Mummy Returns. It was Silly but fun IMHO.....
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Postby Gandalf'sMother » Sat Jun 16, 2001 2:32 pm

Dudalb,<BR><BR>Quit the crusade man. I am hardly the type of person who wishes to impose my morality on others. I seem to remember you stating that "copyright piracy is wrong." Did I yell, and scream, and demand that you stop imposing your views on me. Did I label you a pompous, over-righteous elitist? No. I responded civilly. It seems you are incapable of doing that. If you simply told me that "the Mummy Returns" is not by fact a "bad movie" I would have agreed with you, for entertainment is indeed a matter of personal taste (and I do not believe anyone can dictate requirements for what is pleasurable and what is not---heck I will even listen to someone argue the artistic merit of Britney Spears). Instead, you opted to sling baseless personal attacks at me. Holding grudges is childish. I hold no ill will towards yourself, and I would appreciate it if you would drop the ill will you consistently direct towards myself. <BR><BR>Having said that, I would still like to comment on what I feel is the perpetuation of a superficial taste for art. The problem here, is that typical movie-goers don't just like movies like Mummy Returns, they actually think those movies are better than those with more substance. And a significant reason for this trend lies in the fact that the general public is constantly bombarded with shallow, mass-produced material every day, from commercials to bad sitcoms, that anything of more substance is viewed as uncomfortable, and ultimately undesirable. However, I personally do not thing a movie must be dark, or slow, or constantly thought provoking. I like to relax my mind on occasion as well. And so I have enjoyed films like Indiana Jones, Star Wars etc., which are all fun and campy, yet incredibly well done. I don't have to think at all while watching them. Mummy Returns was not such an enjoyable experience. It was a series of events crammed into a 2 1/2 hour time period, with a relentless quick-cut, MTV style frantic pace that did nothing but cause me to develop a severe headache for the next couple weeks. There was absolutely no substance to underly the comedy, the action, and the SFX (which were all underwhelming anyway.) Worst of all, due to the 5 million different action sequences, you just knew that whoever had made the movie was not looking to make a fun, entertaining film; they were just looking to cash in through a shameless display of money shots. Souless entertainment does not deserve any of my respect, and I do not think it is good for the general public either. It simply serves to degenerate the quality of films that will be produced in the future, which can only aid in the degeneration of our society.<BR><BR>That is my opinion. If you want to offer your opinion on "why" you enjoyed the movie, I invite you to do so (and welcome it.) If you are simply going to say, "I liked it, that's my opinion, so there!," I am afraid I cannot view your comments seriously. <BR><BR>-Mother Maiar
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Postby Semprini » Sat Jun 16, 2001 2:41 pm

<i>GM, anybody tell you that at time you give the impression that anybody who does not like the things you like is either stupid or evil? I enjoyed the Mummy Returns. It was Silly but fun IMHO..... </i><BR><BR>GM did not seem to imply that, Dudalb. He said I believe , and rightfully so, that Mummy Returns was so bad that one may be dismayed by its box office figures. If you like cinema, I suppose you have been disappointed by what summer movies have had to offer this year. So don't you understand that if people go see movies like Mummy Returns in droves, studios will continue to produce second rate films packed with useless special effects? I am saddened by this situation. It does not mean that I think movie-goers are stupid.<BR><BR>I agree with GM. Mummy Returns is the worst movie I have seen this year. A movie drained of its substance that falls within the category of objectively bad movies IMHO.
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Postby dudalb » Sat Jun 16, 2001 5:11 pm

Let's get this straight,GM you want every movie to be serious film about a serious topic? That is the impression I am getting.<BR>I never said the Mummy returns awas a great or even memorable film. I said I though it was a fun two hours. Most of the action scenes were well staged, there were some really nice touches...espcially by the pygmy mummies...and I enjoyed it. It like trying to describe why you like a Roller Coaster ride. It was trying to be nothing but a fun two hours and I am not going to judge it by the same standards I would a film trying to be more serious.<BR>DOn't you ever go to a Movie just for fun? OR do you want Trainspotting or Traffic every time out. That would get to be depressing for me.<BR>And if you think light action films are going to stop be popular , forget it.They have always, since the days of the silents, and always will be popular. They can be well done or badly done. I will not go see TOmb Raider becasue it is apparently badly done.<BR>I agree it is bad to see nothing but action films, but there is another extreme also. GM, is there anything wrong with going to a movie just for fun? It's silly to judge a film like the Mummy 2 by the same standrads you would for say, Citizen Kane....<BR>
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Postby Celebrim » Sat Jun 16, 2001 5:33 pm

"It's silly to judge a film like the Mummy 2 by the same standrads you would for say, Citizen Kane...."<BR><BR>I offer that it is not silly to judge a film like Mummy 2 by the same standards as Star Wars, Jaws, Close Encounters, Terminator 2, Blade Runner, The Maltese Falcon, The Sixth Sense, Wings, Spartacus, Lawerence of Arabia, Alien, Dirty Harry, The Great Escape, E.T., Indiana Jones, etc. If it where silly to judge Mummy 2 by the standards of past great action movies, then by what standards could we judge it? Furthermore, it is probably not completely unjustified to judge many of those above films by the same standards as Citizen Kane, Chariots of Fire, Sense and Sensibility, Little Women, Amadeus, Casablanca, The Sound of Music, or <insert your favorite movie here>. Therefore, if a movie can feed both the conscious and unconscious mind of the viewer by proving both intellectual interest and viceral excitement, then perhaps its not silly to say that even an 'action movie' can be judged by the same standards as Citizen Kane. And furthermore, if you do love cinema as art OR entertainment, that you would desire that every movie live up to those standards to some extent. <BR><BR>I've never seen Mummy 2, but if it is anything like The Mummy (and I've heard that its even lamer and more brainless than the original) I have no desire to do so. 'Mere' entertainment is not brainless, as any attempt to produce entertainment will reveal to you. The problem we have is that since people will watch anything (out of boredom?), there is no real impetus to produce quality - especially in the area in which quality is hardest to produce, the script. Almost every American film is so underwritten now that its like reading a bad preschool book. So, since producing a quality script is so difficult (and expensive) and does not consitantly yield better returns than a movie like, say, 'Mummy 2', Hollywood just skips the whole process.
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Postby Telemachos » Sat Jun 16, 2001 7:31 pm

I gotta side with GM on this one. I never expect Hollywood blockbusters to be anything but 2+ hours of fun and rollicking adventure. Or substitute hard-core kick-ass action, for those R-rated films. <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif"border=0> These are the types of films that Hollywood has always made fairly decently, for the most part. But what I demand OF ANY MOVIE is logic (to a certain degree; I don't want to be scratching my head wondering about some silly point in the middle of the film), the decency to assume that I am an intelligent human being, and some vaguely half-way decent characterizations.<BR><BR>"The Mummy" did fill those requirements (although barely). But its sequel (IMHO, at least) didn't. There was no attempt at anything resembling a coherent plot, characters who were developed slightly, or even a drawn-out, extremely well-conceived action scene. There was simply a mish-mash of "instant action" squished together for 2 hours combined with mediocre (at best) FX. <BR><BR>"Tomb Raider", btw, is even worse.<BR><BR>Compare that to "Die Hard", "Terminator 2", or "Aliens". "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon". Hell, even "Speed" or "Batman", or even something like "The Rock" or "Gladiator". <BR><BR>They aren't even making an effort to put together a decent story any more, and that depresses me. <i>These are the films that Hollywood should be cranking out by the truckload!</i> They needn't tremendously deep or have any insight into human nature -- just give me characters I believe in stuck in situations that are hard to get out of. Throw in some nifty FX (subject to the story, not the reverse), some well-done kinetic thrills, and you've sold me.<BR><BR>But it just ain't happening that much anymore. <img src="i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif"border=0>
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Postby Gandalf'sMother » Sat Jun 16, 2001 8:46 pm

<i>I like to relax my mind on occasion as well. And so I have enjoyed films like Indiana Jones, Star Wars etc., which are all fun and campy, yet incredibly well done.</i><BR><BR>Apparently you missed that portion of my post. Either that, or you enjoy strengthening your point through omission. Unfortunately, it didn't work. Fun, comic entertainment is not mindless. Thought needs to be given to structure and characterization, despite its non-serious nature. I love Monty Python films. So does much of the general public. They are not mindless. Absurdist maybe, but definitely not mindless. IMNSHO, the Mummy Returns was completely mindless.<BR><BR>-Mother Maiar<BR><BR>
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