Ask Aunt Ethel and Sister Saro - we're here to help!

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Postby Ethel » Mon Sep 16, 2002 2:33 pm

Hello, gentle reader, and welcome to TolkienOnline. (You'll also see the site referred to as 'TORC' because the domain name used to be TheOneRing.Com) This is a wonderful place for discussing Tolkien's books and Peter Jackson's movies, and there is also good discussion to be had on non-Tolkien books and movies. I hope you will enjoy it here as much as I have.<BR><BR>I do most of my posting in the Books and Movies forums, with an occasional foray into Philosophy or Talk. I am probably not the best choice of mentor if you are primarily interested in Roleplaying, Games, or Alliances & Guilds as I rarely visit those forums.<BR><BR>To start with a little generic advice:<BR><UL><li>Lurk and read for a while, to get the feel of a forum, before you begin to post.<li>Be slow to start new threads. If you don't see a thread on the topic that interests you, use the Search function. Redundant threads use extra bandwidth and have been known to draw unkind responses - you don't need the aggravation!<li>Please use proper spelling, grammar, capitalization and punctuation. Nothing draws 'flame' responses here faster than 'Netspeak' (u no what i mn!) Posts in proper English are much likelier to receive positive and thoughtful responses. Expressing yourself clearly is also just more courteous, especially to the many posters for whom English is a second language.<li>It's fine to disagree, and even to do so passionately - but it's important to be polite and to avoid insults and personal attacks.<li>This is a message board, not a chat room. That's great, because it gives you the opportunity to converse with people all over the world. But the pace tends to be a little slower than chat, so try to be patient! <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif"border=0><li>If you are under 18, please do not give out your age or identifying details - this is for your protection.</UL><BR>But you can post whatever you like in <i>here</i> as long as it's not a TOS (Terms of Service) voilation!<BR><BR>Please take the time to read the Terms of Service (linked below), and the first post in the Comprehensive Introduction thread (also linked below) which is chock full of useful information about the site:<OL><a target="_blank" href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/tos.cfm"]Terms of Service[/l]<BR><BR><a target="_blank" href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?catid=30&threadid=23795&ann=1"]FrodoTook's "Comprehensive Introduction to this Messageboard"[/l]</OL>Again, welcome to this wonderful website. I'll be happy to help you have a good experience here any way I can - ask and I will answer!<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel<BR><BR><BR><b>Please Note: I asked my very first adoptee, Saroneuroe (or Saro), to become my "co-adopter" and she has graciously agreed. And now, a word from Cousin Saro:</b><BR><BR>Hi! I'm Saroneuroe (please call me Saro)<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0> and I'd like to join Ethel in welcoming you to TORC. I can't think of a better place for Tolkien fans, either of the books or the movies. While I often post in the movies forum and in The Bird and Baby: talk, my main interest is reading and I spend a lot of my time in Books: Other Authors. I encourage you to go out and explore the boards. There's some fascinating stuff out there. TORC is a big message board, so it can be a bit confusing at times, but we're here to help!<BR><BR>Saro<BR><BR>------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><i>By the way, we also have a "chat" thread for our adoptees (and friends) in the Talk forum. It's for "off-topic" conversion - ie, things unrelated to learning your way around TORC. All of our adoptees are welcome to post there. Those conversations tend to be light and humorous, and many non-adoptees participate as well. It's really just for fun, and it's entirely up to you whether you want to take part. Here's the link if you are interested:</i><OL><a target="_blank" href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?catid=24&threadid=57623"]Tea with Auntie... or maybe something a little stronger?[/l]</OL>Ooops! The "Tea with Auntie" grew too big (2,000 posts) and now there's a new one:<OL><a target="_blank" href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?start=0&catid=24&threadid=68382"]Tea with Auntie... New! Improved! With scones![/l]</OL>Just jump right to the end and introduce yourself - very nice people!<BR><BR>Auntie Ethel
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Postby Saroneuroe » Mon Sep 16, 2002 4:35 pm

Ethel,<BR><BR>I'm a newbie in need of adoption. My main interest is books, though I am also interested in movies and games. I picked the "grey havens" alliance when I signed up, because it just seemed right for me, but then I couldn't really find what it means. Maybe you can explain it to me. The alliances and guilds message boards seemed a little unwieldy. Isn't there a list somewhere outlining what the alliances mean?<BR><BR>I can't believe that I never found this site before. It's great! I just need a little help learning the ropes.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>Saroneuroe<BR><BR>
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Postby Ethel » Mon Sep 16, 2002 5:25 pm

Hello, Saroneuroe - welcome and well met! I would be pleased and proud to adopt you. The Alliance you select pretty much just lets you choose a graphic - it doesn't create a geniune affiliation. (But welcome to my alliance all the same!) I'm a pretty visual person and I originally chose Minas Morgul as my alliance because I liked the look of the black banner with the crescent moon. But then someone in the Tolkien Books forum objected that I was 'scaring Frodo' <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-rolleyes.gif"border=0> so I switched. You'll find pleny of people with Minas Morgul, Angbad, Mordor, etc alliances - and none of them seem to be particularly evil. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0><BR><BR>One's alliance doesn't seem to have all that much to do with the "Peoples of Middle-earth: Alliances and Guilds" forum. Though there are some threads devoted to the 'selectable' alliances in there, there are also threads devoted to New Zealand, Goths, Insanity, Gardening, and so forth - no banners or shields for them!<BR><BR>It really is a great site, Saroneuroe, and I'm glad you've found it. I think it offers the best Tolkien-related discussion to be found on the internet - intelligent, literate and well-informed.<BR><BR>Enjoy!<BR>Ethel
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Postby Ethel » Mon Sep 16, 2002 5:25 pm

Oh, dear. Looks like I get to introduce you to one of the odd features of TORC... sometimes, even if you only click 'Done' once, you end up with a double post! I always edit mine so as to leave only one with the original text...
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Postby Ethel » Mon Sep 16, 2002 5:27 pm

Sometimes it's even a triple post! Grrrrr!
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Postby Saroneuroe » Mon Sep 16, 2002 7:35 pm

Ethel,<BR><BR>I'm looking forward to the Toronto 2003 event. That's how I found out about this site. There were posts on The Official Fan Club site, so I decided to check it out. I'm glad I did!<BR><BR>your grateful adoptee,<BR><BR>Saroneuroe <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0>
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Postby InnocentEvil » Mon Sep 16, 2002 7:42 pm

Welcome Ethel, to the new forum! We're pleased to have you start your adoption career here <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif"border=0> I see you found someone already, Saroneuroe(had to look at that four times to make sure it was right).<BR><BR>A note about Alliances to you both. This is one of the forums scheduled for a big reworking. Look for details later this fall!
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Postby Ethel » Mon Sep 16, 2002 9:17 pm

InnocentEvil - Thanks for making my ignorance about Alliances and Guilds seem perfectly natural! <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0><BR><BR><BR>Saroneuro,<BR>Do you mind if I ask <i>you</i> a few questions, just to help us get to know each other a little? (I'll answer my own questions as well as any you may add.) If you feel uncomfortable answering any of these questions, please just don't answer. This is meant to be "getting to know you" (da da da DA da) not a police interrogation.<BR><BR><b>A few starting questions:</b><BR><i>1. How did you choose your screen name?</i><BR><i>2. What stage of life are you in? (student, work, parent, etc?)</i><BR><i>3. Where do you live in Real Life? (very roughly)</i><BR><i>4. When did you first read Tolkien? How many times? Do you love the books?</i><BR><i>5. Have you seen Peter Jackson's FOTR, and did you like it?</i><BR><i>6. DO you have definite plans to attend the Toronto event?</i><BR><BR><BR><b>Ethel's Answers:</b><BR><i>1. How did you choose your screen name?</i><BR>It's from Shakespeare in Love. To please his producer, Shakespeare pretends for a time to be working on a play called Romeo and Ethel the Pirate's Daughter. Some people think Ethel is a dumb screen name but I'm fond of it. For one thing, you know right away who liked Shakespeare in Love - they always comment. For the other there's no competition: I never end up Ethel37!<BR><BR><i>2. Some idea of your life 'stage' (student, working, parent, etc)?</i><BR>I am a single mother with an 18 year old son and a fairly demanding computer-related job.<BR><BR><i>3. Where do you live in Real Life? (very roughtly)</i><BR>I live close to Sacramento, California<BR><BR><i>4. When did you first read Tolkien? How many times? Do you love the books?</i><BR>Read Tolkien when I was 14 or 15 - fell in love and still am. Honestly do not know how many times I've read the books, but it can't be less than 30.<BR><BR><i>5. Have you seen Peter Jackson's FOTR, and did you like it?</i><BR>Yes and yes indeed!<BR><BR><i>6. Do you have definite plans to attend the Toronto event?</i><BR>I'd LOVE to, but it's a long way from California... still thinking it over.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel
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Postby Saroneuroe » Tue Sep 17, 2002 6:19 am

Ethel,<BR><BR>I'll be glad to share some personal info.<BR><BR>1. I use arwen for a lot of things, but I figured that that one would be taken <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0>, so I just went to one of those "translate your name into elvish" sites. Saroneuroe=savior follower=christian=Kirsten (my RL name). That doesn't reflect any *strong* religious belief. It's just a translation of my name.<BR><BR>2. I'm 36 and married with a four year old son (who is, of course, cute beyond words and unbelievably precocious <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0>). I married my high school sweetheart and we've been happily married for 11 years. In RL I do bio-medical research.<BR><BR>3. In RL I'm in the Boston area. We just moved back here 3 years ago, after 9 years in Chicago.<BR><BR>4. I first read "The Hobbit" at age twelve. I don't know how many times I've read the books, though I make it a point to read them once a year, anyway. I have to admit that I've never made it the whole way through "The Silmarillion." I'm a voracious reader. I read about two novels per week, mostly SF, some non-fic, and a few mainstream best-sellers (usually forced on me by my mother-in-law, who claims to like SF, but only reads mainstream novels and Star Trek novels).<BR><BR>5. I love the movie. I don't think that he could have done a better job. Of course, I missed some of the character development, but a movie has to <b>move</b> and this one had a lot of ground to cover!!<BR><BR>6. I <u>definitely</u> plan to attend Toronto. As soon as the hotel info becomes available, I'll book a room. Worldcon is at Toronto next year as well, so I may be making two trips to Toronto, but if I only make one of the two, it will be the Tolkien gathering!<BR><BR>I didn't remember the "Ethel" reference from "Shakespeare in Love", but I did like the movie a lot. I think that my favorite movie of all time is "Bladerunner." I just reread "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep" by Philip K. Dick. I remeber that the first time that I read it I thought that it had the opposite message to the movie, but now I'm not so sure.<BR><BR>Have any pets? I used to show basenjis in conformation and obedience. My current dog is a neutered male. His registered name is Istari's Return of the King, but his call name, "Pippin" is more appropriate. He's a bit of a goof. We just moved into a new house, so I'm hoping to get a new puppy in the next year or two.<BR><BR>Here's to a happy "family"!<BR><BR>Saroneuroe<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
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Postby InnocentEvil » Tue Sep 17, 2002 8:48 am

<i>InnocentEvil - Thanks for making my ignorance about Alliances and Guilds seem perfectly natural</i><BR><BR>Ethel, I profess to be ignorant in SO many areas <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0> If I made you feel bad, I do apologize. If not, you've got a question for the School already if you choose to ask it.<BR><BR>I always wondered if you picked your name for Ethel the Pirate's Daughter from Shakespeare in Love (LOVE that movie!)<BR><BR>I shall step out of this thread now and let the mentoring continue.
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Postby Ethel » Tue Sep 17, 2002 9:23 am

Hi Saroneuroe,<BR><BR>(I'm trying not to think of you as the Euro-Sauron... <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif"border=0>)<BR><BR>I worked on a project based in Boston back in 1999 and spent a lot of time there - I think it's a great city. I grew up in the Eastern US and in many ways still think of myself as an Easterner - despite the fact that I've lived in California since I was 16.<BR><BR>I'm also quite fond of Chicago. How did you like it there? One of my brothers lived there for a long time and I often visited. Dreadful weather of course, but I loved the 'big city' vitality.<BR><BR>So you have a 4 year old... that's such a great age. I have a cherished memory of my son at 4 sitting on my lap with his arms around my neck, saying "I love you, Mommy. You're so beautiful. Your skin smells like flowers." <i>*swoon*</i> Now <i>that's</i> something that doesn't happen any more! On the other hand, it's handy being able to send him to the store. My son is a senior in high school this year so we're in applying to college mode.<BR><BR>Sounds like you're a standard "whacked out Tolkien geek" - like me, and like most of the people who frequent these boards. You should fit right in!<BR><BR>I love the movie too. I really didn't pay much attention to it until it was released because I was fairly sure it would be awful. (New Zealand? And who is this Peter Jackson guy anyway?) I was stunned by how good it was. I kept going back to see it "one more time". It was when I realized I had to stop boring my friends on the subject that I went searching on the internet - and ended up here. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I would <i>like</i> to go to the Toronto meeting. I've gotten very fond of some of the people who post here and would love to meet them in RL. <BR><BR>I like Bladerunner too. I think it had some structural problems as a movie, but the 'look' and atmosphere are amazing. I've never read the book. Have to admit I wasn't all that impressed with the Philip K Dick stuff I've read so far - would you recommend Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?<BR><BR>I'm not quite sure what a basenji is... what do they look like? I love dogs but only have a cat at present. I used to have a very tiny dwarf bunny who was cute as a bug's ear - had him litter trained and everything - but alas, he passed on to the big lettuce patch in the sky just last week. They told me he'd live about 5 years, but in fact it was almost 8. *sniff*<BR><BR>The last book I read was A Primate's Memoir, written by a neuroscientist who spent a long time observing baboons in Africa. It was just wonderful and I highly recommend it. I'm currently rereading War and Peace - one of my all time favorite books.<BR><BR>So... what forums have you visited so far? Books-Tolkien is great for talking about LOTR and so forth - there are all levels of knowledge there, including some real Tolkien scholars. Books-Other frustrates me a little bit because nearly all the threads are about what I think of as 'second tier' fantasy - Terry Brooks and Robert Jordan and so forth. Every once in a while I start a thread there but they usually sink like a stone! The silly season has officially set in at Movies-Tolkien - my main forum. There's just not much to talk about right now, but no one wants to stop talking - hence the proliferation of silly threads (and I'm very definitely a guilty party - check out the Celebrate Celeborn thread for an extreme example of silliness.) Movies-Other usually has some interesting things going on. Go forth and join the discussions!<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel<BR><BR>PS - You can also email me at: <a href="mailto:JanLewis4@aol.com">JanLewis4@aol.com</a> (I'm trying to wean myself from using my work email for fun stuff)<BR><BR>PS - you should at least scroll through the Celebrate Celeborn thread to see what people have done with their sig pics. Some of them are very funny. I think Steerpike's is the best!
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Postby Saroneuroe » Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:23 am

Ethel,<BR><BR>Yes, four years old is a lot of fun. He's so loving. I don't want the hugs and snuggles to end, but I know that they will. I kind of wonder what reading Tolkien will be like for him. I just stumbled across LOTR when I was twelve, but he's already seen the Bakshi version of The Hobbit and I've read him shortened versions of it. He's just starting to get ready to let me read him books without pictures. We started "Stuart Little" last night. Not my favorite of the classic children's books, but he's seen the movie, so he was enthusiastic.<BR><BR>We started out our married life in Chicago, since there was *no* way we would be able to buy a house in the Boston area and my husband already had a job there. I moved out there with the idea that we would buy a house, build up some equity, and then return to Boston where we would raise a family. My husband really loved Chicago and, if it had been solely up to him, I think that we would have remained there. We lived on the south side and though we had lots of "doggy" and "gaming" friends, I never really felt that I fit in. If we'd been on the north side (trust me there's a big difference), we might still be there. So here we are, according to plan, if a little later than I'd hoped.<BR><BR>I was very worried about the movie because I *had* seen "The Frighteners" directed by PJ. But , the more that I saw, the more enthusiastic I got. I can't wait for TTT!<BR><BR>Basenjis are similar in size to Jack Russell Terriers, about 17" high at the shoulder. They're smooth-coated with prick ears and a tail that curls over the back. They were first brought over from Africa (Republic of the Congo) in the forties. They don't bark, although they do make a lot of other noises, howling, etc. They even have a warning bark, but its just one short "berf" when they're startled. No yap, yap, yap. If I have a picture on this computer, I'll email a photo to you.<BR><BR>Sorry to hear about your bunny. I had a friend who had one as a pet when I was in high school, but she wasn't very friendly. My first basenji, CH Kibushi Arwen of Signet, CD (Pippin's mom, Winnie) died at age 5 while I was 20 weeks pregnant. She had a fungal infection in her lung. She fought it off once, but succombed 6 months later. I coulnd't stop crying when I thought about it for months. We did everything together. It was pretty awful. <BR><BR>I've recently read a lot of Philip K. Dick. I decided to read the "minority report" short story, since I saw some movie reviews that alluded to it. He's *very* dark. Don't expect much in the way of happy endings. I like "sheep" a lot and will probably read it again in the future. What did you read of his that you didn't like? I have to admit that I never finished "the Man in the High castle", but I do like his short stories. Maybe I can only stand the dark for relatively short periods of time.<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0><BR><BR>Right now, I'm reading "Word Freak" a non-fic book about obsessive Scrabble players and I'm about to reread "the Gate to Women's Country" by Sheri Tepper. I'll keep "A Primate's Memoir" in mind for future reading. Most of the non-fic that I read is science-related, so that's right up my alley.<BR><BR>I've posted on the events board, trying to see if anyone in the Boston area is doing anything for TTT. And I posted something on a thread about "Dune", another of my all-time favorites!<BR><BR>I'd better get back to work!<BR><BR>Saroneuroe<BR>
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Postby Ethel » Tue Sep 17, 2002 5:43 pm

Hi Saroneuroe,<BR> <BR>Fear not. The snuggles end but the hugs don't. My almost-18-year-old (he turns 18 Saturday) is still very affectionate. I did go through a thing when he was about 14 where I found myself sort of mourning for the little boy I had so loved, who'd been replaced by this hairy, deep-voiced teenager - actually teared up a time or two. (cue Sunrise, Sunset) But I slapped myself and got over it.<BR><BR>I <i>just loved</i> reading to my son. I did a lot of things wrong as a mother, but that's one thing I'm sure I will never regret. Four is a little young but your son is six or so I'd recommend Lloyd Alexander's Prydain Chronicles. Alex (my boy) and I both loved them. Then there's LOTR to look forward to!<BR><BR>You mention "gaming" friends. What type of gaming do you mean?<BR><BR>I really can't wait for TTT either, not least because we desperately need something new to talk about on the Movies board. I love the people over there but we've sort of run out of substantive things to say. Last time I checked there were FIVE "Peter Jackson is the new (whoever)" threads. But this too will pass.<BR><BR>I shall look forward to your email. (I'm writing this at work.) I was curious so I Googled on basenjis - very cute they are, and of course I had heard of them once you reminded me: the famous barkless dogs.<BR><BR>Speaking of barkless critters that nevertheless make noises - my bunny had two noises. One was a startlingly loud growl that he used when he was defending his turf - and if there's anything funnier than having a 4 pound bunny charge at you growling, I'd like to know what it is. The other noise was a low rhythmic humming sort of sound - a happy noise he'd make when running figure eights around your feet.<BR><BR>Yes, I'm still mourning Mr. Bun a bit. But bunnies are a little different than cats or - especially - dogs. They're cute and fun, but somehow it isn't very personal. So I am very sorry to hear about Winnie; I know a dog can be almost like a human friend. I lost a cat when I was pregnant and talk about unnumbered tears!<BR><BR>I think the Philip K. Dick I read was called "Time Out of Joint". Something like that. I really liked the first part, which was this guy realizing that All was Not As It Seemed - very well done, very intriguing. I just didn't buy the explanation when it came, so the whole thing kind of fell apart for me. But I'll give him another try. I do like science fiction, but a lot of it is SO badly written. Mr. Dick has a certain elegance. I like Sherri S. Tepper too, and I thought "The Gate to Women's Country" was her best.<BR><BR>So what's this biomedical research you do? Please tell me it doesn't involve tormenting bunnies. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-crying.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I can't think of anyone on TORC in the Boston area, though I know there are some. My dear 'Mammo' lives in Connecticut - she's great and so is her daughter 'Vynaca_of_Mirkwood'. I'm hoping to join the LA crowd for TTT.<BR><BR>So... what strikes you funny? Are you a Monty Python fan? Did you like the "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy"?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel<BR><BR>Edited to add: And may I just say how grateful I am that this wasn't another triple post! What's <i>up</i> with that?<BR><BR>Second edit: Saroneuroe, I added a link in the first message of this thread that you should probably check out. The thread it links to is huge, but the 'key' information is in the first post. It covers everything from how to make smilies to guidelines on roleplaying.<BR>
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Postby Saroneuroe » Tue Sep 17, 2002 6:48 pm

Ethel,<BR><BR>Wow! I must be in the right place, if the first person I chat with knows who Sheri Tepper is!<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif"border=0> She's one of my favorites. I admit she can be a bit preachy, but I just eat it up! Have you read the "True Game" series?<BR><BR>I had forgotten about Lloyd Alexander. That's definitely something to look forward to.<BR><BR>My husband and I collect board games and card games. We'll play just about anything. I haven't done any role-playing in over ten years, though. Currently, we're playing a lot of the LOTR collectible card game (of course.)<BR><BR>Speaking of talking bunnies...Have you read/watched Watership Downs? If not, you really should.<BR><BR>I haven't read "Time out of Joint." I read a bunch of short stories, "sheep" (it's really novella length, I think, and "Ubik" recently. I loved some of the short stories and "sheep", but "Ubik" was a little disappointing.<BR><BR>I'm a micro-injectionist. That is, I produce transgenic mice for research, by injecting transgenic constructs into mouse ova. Other scientists study the mice to determine what various human genes do. Nothing to do with bunnies. My feelings on animal research are that<BR>1. It should be done humanely by people who care about animals (which I do)<BR>2. It should be work that contributes to society, not just research that extends peoples' careers. (I quit a job with someone who I didn't feel was doing productive, interesting, and worthwhile research.)<BR><BR>My current boss is doing cutting edge work on the immune system, contributing to Cancer and Transplant Research.I don't mean to sound defensive, but I know from experience that some people have *strong* negative opinions of *any* animal research. I hope you understand.<BR><BR>And now for something completely different!<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I enjoy Monty Python and Douglas Adams. We watch a lot of BBC america. I find the show "Iron Chef" on FoodTV pretty funny. Have you ever watched it? As a general rule, I don't enjoy gross-out type humor.<BR><BR>I did send a photo. I hope you enjoy it!<BR><BR>Saroneuroe
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Postby Ethel » Tue Sep 17, 2002 10:58 pm

Saroneuroe,<BR> <BR>I do really love Sheri Tepper. I liked "Grass" and I liked "Raising the Stones" too. Have you read "The Family Tree"? I must say that one freaked me out a bit - beyond preachy all the way to misanthropic, I thought, though very well done. Not sure I know what you mean by the "True Game" series - explain?<BR><BR>Need more explanation about the games you're into. Are we talking Scrabble here? And I somehow thought the LOTR collectible card game was a type of role-playing game... ? (maybe I'm the one who needs a mentor!) My son and I love games too, but we tend to play the "standard" ones - Scrabble, Boggle, Taboo, to name a couple. Oh, a new one we really like is Apples to Apples.<BR><BR>Yes, I've read Watership Down. But, as a recent bunny owner, I must tell you that that book really romanticizes rabbits. My bunny was cute as a button but dumb as a rock. Alex once had a pet rat that was like Galileo compared to the bunny.<BR><BR>I'm sorry for winding you up about bunny torment. One of my closest friends is a Physiology professor at UC Davis, and I've developed a bad habit of talking about such things in a flip way. Like you, she is an animal lover. Like you (and me) she believes in the necessity of animal research, but that it should be done humanely.<BR><BR>I think I'm actually a little familiar with the type of work you describe. I am involved with the Huntington's Disease Society of America, and a couple of years ago they reported as a great triumph that a "mouse model" had been developed for the disease - a HUGE breakthrough for this tragic genetic illness. For the first time ever, there may be hope for treatment. So, no, I do not object to the work you do. I honor it.<BR><BR>And now for something completely silly! One of the funniest posters in the Movies Forum is Hama. He started the following thread in answer to a question of mine. It's a fun insight into the "old days" at TORC. Follow the first link in the first post. I loved it - hope you do too.<BR><BR><a target=new href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?catid=13&threadid=51622">http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?catid=13&threadid=51622</a><BR><BR>Regards,<BR>Ethel
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Postby Saroneuroe » Wed Sep 18, 2002 3:35 am

Ethel,<BR><BR>If you like Sheri Tepper you *must* read the "True Game" series. There are 9 books. They're all out of print, but easy to find. They are older and a little more light-hearted than most of her stuff.<BR><BR>Glad to hear you support research. You never know when you're meeting someone for the first time.<BR><BR>I *love* Scrabble. My mom is the only one who will play with me. I'm actually thinking about joining a local Scrabble club, so that I can play for the rest of the year (My mom visits us in July.)<BR><BR>We own apples to apples, but haven't played it yet.<BR><BR>I'm getting ready to leave for work. I'll check out the link later!<BR><BR>Saronoroe
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Postby Saroneuroe » Wed Sep 18, 2002 3:38 am

OOPs! My turn for a double post!!<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-rolleyes.gif"border=0><BR>
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Postby Ethel » Wed Sep 18, 2002 7:06 pm

Hi Saronoroe,<BR><BR>I love Scrabble too but I suspect I'm not in your class. The game everyone refuses to play with me is Boggle. Funny how that works. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0><BR><BR>Saw your second post over in Tolkien-Books and just have to say that I love "Bellwether" too - it was such a change of pace after "The Doomsday Book."<BR><BR>I'll look for the Tepper series - always glad to find new reading material.<BR><BR>Ethel<BR>
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Postby Saroneuroe » Thu Sep 19, 2002 5:47 am

Ethel,<BR><BR>Thanks for the links. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0> I finally got around to reading them this morning. It took me a little while to notice that the alternating posts were being posted at the same time! <BR><BR>I've been mostly lurking around the non-Tolkien books section. I'm a little too intimidated to jump right into the Tolkien Books threads. I feel like I should at *least* read "The Silmarillion" all the way through first before I jump in there. I'm sure I'll get more comfortable as I go along.<BR><BR>I didn't discover Connie Willis until last year. I actually read "The Bellwether" first. Then "To Say Nothing of the Dog" which I thought was a little weak for a Hugo winner (I kept feeling that there were at *least* two other books that I needed to read first in order to enjoy this one- too many inside jokes.), but I *did* LOVE "The Doomsday Book."<BR><BR>I hope you're able to find the True Game books. They were printed individually in paperback and in HC book club editions as three volumes (though I've never seen the middle one available.) The middle three books are just a rehash of the first three from a different perspective, so, if you can't find them, go ahead to the last three. You won't miss much plot. I agree with you about "The Family Tree." I thought that maybe she had gone over the top (OK- by at least a mile<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif"border=0>), but it was a very enjoyable read. I actually heard an NPR interview with her about that book. It was pretty interesting.<BR><BR>ttyl,<BR><BR>Saroneuroe<BR><BR>PS- re:bunnies are "dumb as rocks" They're geniuses of epic proportins when compared with Guinea Pigs!!<BR>
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Postby Ethel » Thu Sep 19, 2002 11:54 am

Hi Saroneuroe!<BR><BR>I provided that link just to give you some idea of the flavor of the Tolkien Movies forum at its best. The great thing (I think) about that thread is you almost believe it at first until you realize that "ukhem" is being rather too insistent about throat singing. Hama is famous for posting complicated jokes under alternate identities - I suspect it may be he who is posting as "The_Real_Celeborn" in my ridiculous "Celebrating Celeborn" thread.<BR><BR>I would encourage you to renounce your fear of the Tolkien Books forum and jump right into any topic that interests you. It's a friendly forum, and the Tolkien knowledge level ranges from "almost nil" to "scary". I make a point of reading anything written by Magpie, ArPharazon, wilko135, TheWagner or roaccarcson - they all know a lot and write beautifully, and I often learn something. (There are plenty more great posters; I just happen to admire these in particular.) It's not my main forum but I stop by when I have a question or observation, or if a topic catches my eye. For instance, here's a fairly recent thread I started over there that got some interesting responses:<BR><BR><a target=new href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=54897">"The Orc Problem" thread in Tolkien Books forum</a><BR><BR>Obviously everything has already been discussed a hundred times over in that forum, but even when people point you to an existing thread they do it very nicely. (Though it's still a good idea to search for your topic before starting a new thread - bumping an old one is often just as good a way to get a discussion going. I would also suggest that you avoid - at all cost - starting any threads about Balrog wings or Legolas's hair color as they been Discussed to Death! <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif"border=0>) I'm linking an active thread in Tolkien Books that you might want to take look at. It's dauntingly long, but I've linked to the last page. It's mostly just a very friendly and thoughtful group of people meditating on LOTR:<BR><BR><a target=new href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?start=800&catid=27&threadid=48833">Frodo's Kitchen: A Safe Haven for Devotees of the Books</a><BR><BR>If you really want to get going on the Silmarillion, there is a group read/study of it in progress in the "Virtual Tolkien Study Group" forum. Looks like they're up to chapters 8 and 9 of the Quenta Silmarillion, which is a pretty good part - the darkening of Valinor and the flight of the Noldor. There are some extremely thoughtful and well-informed discussions going on. I haven't been participating but I drop in once in a while to read some of the posts.<BR><BR>Can you provide titles for Sheri Tepper's True Game series? They might be available used from Amazon if I knew what to look for. Returning to "The Family Tree" - the ending honestly kind of horrified me. But there was a passage in it that was absolutely magical - the one where you gradually realize that the "people" you've been reading about for half the book are really animals.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel<BR><BR>PS - Agreed re Guinea pigs. My brother once had a pair and they were difficult to distinguish from stuffed toys!
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Postby Saroneuroe » Thu Sep 19, 2002 4:31 pm

How do you like my new title. I wanted something to do with basenjis. My "kennel-name"(the prefix on the names of dogs bred by me) is Istari, but I thought "Lady of the Istari" sounded a little pretentious. Of course, as I mentioned earlier silent is a bit of an overstatement when referring to basenjis. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I appreciate all the help finding all the nooks and crannies that might be of interest. I'm already feeling a bit more comfortable. I do feel sort of like I'm back in college somehow. Maybe I should start doing homework. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I think I'll hold off on "The Silmarillion" for now. I have to read a mainstream novel to discuss with my mother-in-law. <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-rolleyes.gif"border=0> She likes to bond by reading books together. Unfortunately, she picks the book, which I dutifully buy and read, and then 1/2 the time she doesn't even read it! I love her, but sometimes...<BR><BR>Talk to you later!
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Postby Saroneuroe » Fri Sep 20, 2002 5:35 am

Hey Ethel,<BR><BR>My banner spontaneously changed to house of cirdan. I noticed that yours also changed. Any idea what happened? At first I thought that the grey havens banner had been replaced with this one, but it's still one of the available options. I don't see any real need to change back. I just thought it was odd.<BR>
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Postby Ethel » Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:29 am

Hi Saroneuroe,<BR><BR>Love the new title - it's both meaningful and mysterious. (I don't think the Istari had ladies anyway!) You could add a picture of Pippin to your signature, too, if you wanted. At first I couldn't figure out what to do with the premiere membership features - just left if blank for a couple of months. Then I found this lovely Burne-Jones painting that I used for a while. At the moment, of course, I am engulfed in Celeborn silliness - and we've planning a whole different kind of silliness for October.<BR><BR>While I'm on this ridiculous topic, I feel I should invite you to participate - if and only if it would amuse you, however. I realize this type of nonsense isn't everyone's cup of tea. The Celeborn thread is here:<BR><BR><a target=new href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?start=300&catid=13&threadid=54552">Celebrating Celeborn! (September is Be Kind to Celeborn Month)</a> <BR><BR>And the discussion about next month's theme - the Men of Middle-earth Pageant - is here:<BR><BR><a target=new href="http://www.tolkienonline.com/thewhitecouncil/messageview.cfm?start=160&catid=13&threadid=54727">What Cometh after Celeborn?</a><BR><BR>Again, no obligation. Just wanted you to know you're welcome if the spirit moves you. <BR><BR>I know what you mean about feeling like you're back in college. That's actually one of the things I love about TORC - that feeling of being part of a bright, curious, creative community with shared interests. But no homework, ever!<BR><BR>Regarding the surprise alliance changes - I asked the question on the "Tolkien Online - The One Ring" forum and got this answer from Ted:<BR><BR>"I am in the process of creating the rest of the Houses Banners for each of the Elven famlies. You were switched from the Grey Havens to House of Cirdan, becuase Cirdan ruled over the Grey Havens. Feel free to switch to something else if you want."<BR><BR>(Ted is one of the founders of Tolkien Online.)<BR><BR>I'll take part in your reading of "Gate to Women's Country"! It's one of my favorite books.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Ethel<BR>
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Postby Ethel » Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:30 am

This is so embarrassing!<BR>
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Postby Ethel » Fri Sep 20, 2002 11:30 am

And why must it always be a TRIPLE post? So excessive!<BR>
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Postby Saroneuroe » Fri Sep 20, 2002 3:58 pm

Ethel,<BR><BR>Can you teach me to do that?? You are my adopter!!!<img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif"border=0><img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif"border=0><BR><BR>I'm glad you'll be reading Gate to Women's Country with me. I hope we get a couple more volunteers!
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Postby Ethel » Sat Sep 21, 2002 10:55 am

Ah, Saroneuroe - if only you could teach me NOT to do it! <img src="http://www.tolkienonline.com/mb/i/expressions/face-icon-small-rolleyes.gif"border=0> Problem is, I don't know <i>how</i> I'm doing it. I think it happens when the server is overloaded. But it's happened so many times in this thread that I've gotten a little gun-shy about replying at all...<BR><BR>Do give me a few days to round up a copy of "Women's Country" - it's one of those books I like so much that I'm always giving my copy away. I was at my local Border's yesterday and they didn't have it so I might have to get it on line...<BR><BR>Ethel<BR><BR><i>Edited to express extreme relief at finding only one copy of this post!</i>
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Postby Saroneuroe » Sat Sep 21, 2002 5:16 pm

Ethel,<BR><BR>If I enter info in my bio, where does it end up being displayed?<BR><BR>No rush about the book. Let me know when you have it.
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Postby Ethel » Sat Sep 21, 2002 9:45 pm

Saroneuroe,<BR><BR>Excellent question. I had no idea of the answer, myself - I've never entered anything in the "My Bio" space. But I passed the question along, and here's the answer I got:<BR><BR>"It shows up when you post in the art gallery or to an article on the main page. Whatever comment you give, in the top right hand corner will appear a box that says you are a premiere member. It will show your sig picture and right underneath it will be a link for you to click on and read that person's bio."<BR><BR>It certainly doesn't show in your signature box, and it doesn't show up when you use the little "glasses" icon on a post to display a profile either. <BR><BR>Love the picture of Winnie...<BR>Ethel
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Postby Saroneuroe » Sun Sep 22, 2002 4:18 pm

Thanks Ethel! I just wandered over to the gallery for the first time. I was surprised (and a bit disappointed) to see so much movie-inspired art.<BR><BR>Getting your Haldir sigs in order??
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