The Official Sindarin Translation Thread II

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The Official Sindarin Translation Thread II

Postby Xandarien » Tue May 29, 2012 2:01 am

Welcome all!

What this thread offers:
Translations from English -> Sindarin
Checking your own Sindarin -> English translations
Answers to any questions you might have about the language of Sindarin

I am also willing to offer translations from English -> Doriathrin Sindarin*

*(See note on Doriathrin below 'About Sindarin')

What I can't do:
Translations into Quenya (you should go to The Official Quenya Translation Thread)
Anything involving Tengwar (you need The Official Tengwar Transcription Thread)

If you would like a translation. please make sure you click POST a REPLY not POST A NEW TOPIC! :D (Easy mistake to make) and please be patient - I usually reply to all requests the same day, but I can't always guarantee this.

Once you have your translation, if you want it transcribed into Tengwar, you need to post it into the Official Tengwar Transcription thread.


About Sindarin

Sindarin was the language used by the Grey Elves in Beleriand, the Teleri who remained behind when the other Elves were called to Valinor.
In the First Age, when the Noldor returned to Beleriand from Valinor, Elu-Thingol (King of Doriath) forbade the use of Quenya (the language of the Noldor) forcing them to learn Sindarin.

During the Second Age, the Men of Numenor spoke Sindarin before they corrupted it to their own language of Adunaic, which is how Sindarin passed to their descendants, the Dúnedain.
In the Third Age, (during which the Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit are set), Sindarin is the first language of the Elves, but is also known by the Men of Gondor (but not as a first language, more of a second language, spoken by the nobility).

Neo-Sindarin

Unfortunately, despite my best efforts, I do have to make up compounds and words from existing stems and words, that use rules set down by Tolkien to cover gaps in the vocabulary. Technically this is termed 'Neo-Sindarin', and it is what every translator uses. Tolkien simply didn't invent enough words for every eventuality. I must stress however, none of the words I use are straight out of my own head, they all come from existing ideas set down by Tolkien himself, so what you get from me is as close as humanly possible to his language.


A note on Doriathrin Sindarin

Doriathrin Sindarin is the original 'pure' Sindarin, spoken by Thingol and his kin in the land of Doriath. There are differences in pronouns, plurals and some other things, making it a full working dialect. When the Noldor returned from Valinor, Sindarin adopted some features of Quenya, and became the language we know today. (There are other dialects too, but there is too little known about them to be able to reliably translate more than a few words into them).

Doriathrin translations are aimed more at people who:
Are looking for a translation that for whatever reason they would like to be in 'Old' Sindarin. Maybe this is because you write fanfiction and your characters either come from or are set in the First/Second Ages, or you've always preferred the High Elves to the diminished Elves of the Third Ages and later, and would like the wording of your tattoo to reflect that.
Or perhaps you simply have a hankering to give me a challenge and like the sound of it :p
Whatever the reason, if you do request this, please be aware that it may take me longer than a normal Sindarin translation.

Thanks for reading! :lol:
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Postby Lilka » Wed May 30, 2012 2:51 am

Hey Xandarien. Me again :wink:

I have a few other sentences to translate.
I did one :

"Everything falls dark" : "Pân danna morn" ?


"I'll bury the pain."

I found "burial mound, barrow, grave, tomb - haudh". Can i make a verb out of that : haudha-? Which would make something like "haudhathon naeg"? But i truly have no idea if that's remotely correct.

And last :

"Nothing else matters"

And there, i have no idea...

Well, anyways thanks again for your time.
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Postby Xandarien » Wed May 30, 2012 3:47 am

Everything falls dark:

Problem with translating this is that it actually sounds a little nonsensical in Sindarin.
If we go with the past tense, and say pân dannant dholl = All (it) falls dark, then it doesn't mean the same as to say in English 'night is falling', this is for something to literally fall from a height. I suppose this could work, but to me it sounds more like 'all falls the dark' (where is it falling to?)

If we go with the future tense though, and change the meaning subtly, then we get:

Pân dannatha dholl = All will fall dark
and the Elf would have a much better understanding of what you were trying to say.

I'll bury the pain

Haudh comes from a root meaning 'Pile, mound', so that wouldn't be suitable for a root for 'to bury'. Quenya doesn't have a verb for 'to bury' either, and I suppose the reason is quite obvious really - the tombs in Tolkien's legendarium are for Men, because an Elf's body disappears very quickly (so it can be reformed for them in Valinor when they come out of the Halls of Mandos). The only exception I can think of to this is Glorfindel really, but as he was reborn anyway...

Instead of 'to bury', what about 'to hide'?

Deliathon i naeg = I will hide the pain

Nothing else matters

Afraid to say I don't have many ideas either! I tried to play around with changing it into 'Nothing has meaning' or something along those lines:

ú-nad thell = Nothing is intended

Problem is, it's one of those phrases that you can't really translate! The Sindarin sentence above is fine, but it doesn't mean the same thing.
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Postby Emoelve » Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:02 am

Hey,
I am looking for an english> sindarin translation for the words:

freedom, dreams, nature

It would be awesome if you could do that for me!
Thanks a lot
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:47 am

Dreams
Elei

Freedom
Well we've got
Lain = Free/Freed
Leithian = Freedom from bondage/Release

Nature - as in human nature, or as in plants and animals?
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Postby Emoelve » Sat Jun 02, 2012 9:08 am

i mean nature in the way of plants, animals, lanscapes and so!

thank you so much
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:53 pm

Unfortunately (and I very rarely ever say this) there's no way of saying 'nature' in the way that you mean it.

There's words for 'earth', but there's no abstract concept meaning 'all plants' or 'all animals' or anything of that ilk.
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Postby FloodZ » Sat Jun 09, 2012 4:51 am

Hey Xandarien!

I am soon getting a tattoo, and I was thinking about getting something written in Sindarin. Could you please translate the sentence: "Never give up" into Sindarin for me? If you don't mind could you even translate: "The time is now"?

Thanks in advance! :)
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:51 am

i lû si = The time (is) now

'Never give up' is a bit too colloquial, I could translate it literally but it would mean 'Never give (something) upwards (vertically)', which isn't what you want!

What about something like 'Never despair' or 'Never sorrow'?
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Postby FloodZ » Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:49 am

The two alternatives you mentioned isn't really what I want... It's a shame that a nice quote as "Never give up" can't be translated... :/

What about: "Create your own destiny"? :)
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:14 am

[Carol/Carog] i [amarth/vanadh] în

"(You) make your own fate"

First choice in brackets -
Carol = You make (formal)
Carog = You make (informal)

Second choice in brackets -
amarth = fate (doom)
v(m)anadh = fate (fortune)

i___în = reflexive, in this case 'your own'

To make a sentence reflexive (the 'your own' part of the sentence) you need the 'you' ending on the verb at the beginning, otherwise it would be Caro i amarth/vanadh lîn, which means "Make your fate!"
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Postby FloodZ » Sat Jun 09, 2012 1:20 pm

Okej, thanks!

So just to make sure this sentence is correct:
"Carog i vanadh in" means "Make your own fate"?

Since both "amarth" and "vanadh" means fate - however they are kind of the opposite to each other; Could you write: "To vanadh or amarth" which would mean something like: "I have to keep on going even though I dont know how the result will be"? Like: "To forture or doom", "To a fate with a good result or to a fate with a bad result".
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 09, 2012 2:25 pm

FloodZ wrote:Okej, thanks!

So just to make sure this sentence is correct:
"Carog i vanadh in" means "Make your own fate"?



Yip that's right.

Since both "amarth" and "vanadh" means fate - however they are kind of the opposite to each other; Could you write: "To vanadh or amarth" which would mean something like: "I have to keep on going even though I dont know how the result will be"? Like: "To forture or doom", "To a fate with a good result or to a fate with a bad result".


Not entirely opposite to each other, they both have connotations of 'fate, doom', just manadh has more to do with fate and fortune than amarth, which means more 'final end'.

I think I know what you're asking for:

An vanadh egor amarth
"To fate or fortune"

Am I right? :)
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Postby FloodZ » Sat Jun 09, 2012 2:51 pm

An vanadh egor amarth
"To fate or fortune"

So "amarth" would mean kind of a bad fate, like when your fate is to die in a battle? However, "vanadh" would mean more like when your fate is to be the victor of the battle? A good fate so to speak? :)

What I am trying to accomplish here is a line that means: "Without knowing if I am going to succeed or fail - I am going to meet my fate".
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Postby Xandarien » Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:19 pm

:?

Either it's because it's late, or I'm just generally confused. I can translate you a sentence along the lines of 'Without knowing my doom, I go to meet my fate'? I'm really not sure what you're after...(spell it out for me :lol: )
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Postby FloodZ » Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:35 pm

What I understand from you is that:
"Vanadh" means "Destiny" with a positive meaning
and...
Amarth means "Destiny" with a negativ meaning

To put in two examples:
Vanadh
"My destiny is to win this game"
Amarth
"My destiny is to lose this game"

Am I correct if: "An vanadh egor amarth" means:
"To my destiny (with a good/successfull outcome) or to my destiny (with a bad/failure outcome)"

Excuse me for being confusing - English is not my native language! :)
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Postby Xandarien » Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:46 am

FloodZ wrote:
Am I correct if: "An vanadh egor amarth" means:
"To my destiny (with a good/successfull outcome) or to my destiny (with a bad/failure outcome)"



Pretty much, yes (and obviously you could change the two words round - An amarth egor vanadh for the opposite meaning).


Excuse me for being confusing - English is not my native language! :)


Your English is fine :wink:
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Postby FloodZ » Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:59 am

But you understand what I want the tattoo to mean, right? And the sentence: "An vanadh egor amarth" would make sense to a person speaking Sindarin? Since it is going to be tattooed on my skin I want to make sure that it actually says the same thing that I want, and not something else... That would be a shame! :)

Do you agree with me that "vanadh" and "amarth" both means "fate", but the first one with a positive outcome and the second mentioned with a negative outcome? Like: "My vanadh is to end up in heaven" and "My amarth is to end up in hell"? This is the most important part of the tattoo to get right I think! :)

Thanks for all your help - I really appreciate it! :)
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Postby Xandarien » Sun Jun 10, 2012 3:11 am

FloodZ wrote:But you understand what I want the tattoo to mean, right? And the sentence: "An vanadh egor amarth" would make sense to a person speaking Sindarin? Since it is going to be tattooed on my skin I want to make sure that it actually says the same thing that I want, and not something else... That would be a shame! :)


Oh aye, definitely, you want to be sure with a tattoo, I understand that.

Yes I believe it does make sense, as it's not just the same idea repeated, they do have two different connotations.

Do you agree with me that "vanadh" and "amarth" both means "fate", but the first one with a positive outcome and the second mentioned with a negative outcome? Like: "My vanadh is to end up in heaven" and "My amarth is to end up in hell"? This is the most important part of the tattoo to get right I think! :)

Thanks for all your help - I really appreciate it! :)


Yes, that works.

Manadh also glosses as 'final bliss', which would work with your idea of heaven/hell for meanings. :)
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Postby FloodZ » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:58 am

Thank you so much Xandarien. I guess "An vanadh egor amarth" it is then! I will take this sentence and ask for help to transcribe it into Tengwar in the other thread. Depending on how it looks I will choose between make a tattoo with the standard alphabetic or tengwar - since I already now really like the look of "An vanadh egor amarth".

Thank you once again,
/Joakim
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Curious

Postby Linwë Tinúviel » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:30 pm

Pardon me, i wanted to ask if you could translate this over for me?

Survivor
Dreamer
Follow your heart
You are my treasure

Thank you so much...
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Postby spidey_mel » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:31 pm

Hi! This is such a wonderful forum I stumbled upon!

I was wondering, if you would be so kind as to translate:

"...And they lived happily ever after" or just "...happily ever after."

into Sindarin for me?

It's eventually going to be a tattoo :)

Thank you so so much!
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Re: Curious

Postby Xandarien » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:18 am

Linwë Tinúviel wrote:Pardon me, i wanted to ask if you could translate this over for me?

Survivor
Dreamer
Follow your heart
You are my treasure

Thank you so much...


Survivor:

Bronor

Dreamer:

Ólor
Ólben


First one is literally 'dreamer', second one is more 'dream person'.

Follow your heart:

Aphado i gûr [gîn/lîn]

Aphado - Follow
gûr - heart (technically it should be i 'ûr gîn/lîn but if this is for a tattoo, then there is no tengwar for the apostrophe so it would end up reading 'your fire' instead of 'your heart')

The choice between brackets is:
gîn = your (informal)
lîn = your (formal)

This is the word for heart in the metaphorical sense, if you want the physical word for heart replace gûr with hûn.

You are my treasure:

Ci i vîr nîn

I assume you would want the informal form of 'you are' here? If not, replace Ci with Le.

Ci = You are
i vîr nîn = my treasure
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Postby Xandarien » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:26 am

spidey_mel wrote:Hi! This is such a wonderful forum I stumbled upon!

I was wondering, if you would be so kind as to translate:

"...And they lived happily ever after" or just "...happily ever after."

into Sindarin for me?

It's eventually going to be a tattoo :)

Thank you so so much!


A guianner gellweg an-uir

A = and
c(g)uianner = they lived
gellweg = joyful
an-uir = for eternity
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Postby Lilka » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:27 am

Hi Xandarien.

Could you check out if "Deliver Us" can be translated into sndarin?

Thanks a lot.
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Postby Xandarien » Wed Jun 27, 2012 5:13 am

Lilka wrote:Hi Xandarien.

Could you check out if "Deliver Us" can be translated into sndarin?

Thanks a lot.


Do you mean this in a Biblical sort of sense, like 'Deliver us from evil'?

(As opposed to 'Deliver us a package'.)
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Postby Lilka » Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:05 am

Yes ! Deliver us (from evil).
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Postby Xandarien » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:22 am

Okay, well there's the basic Sindarin option of

Edraith ammen (look familiar from Lord of the Rings? :) )

which means 'Saving for us'.

The other option is:

Edeledad ammen

Edeleda- is a verb reconstructed from the Quenyan Etelehta- which literally means 'to deliver (from evil)'.
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<3

Postby Linwë Tinúviel » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:44 am

Thanks!
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Postby stever1388 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:39 pm

Greetings!

I was wondering if you could translate this for me:

Allies of the Free Peoples

Thanks!
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